HARDLISTENING

Tokyo, 2001.2
text by Yoshiyuki Suzuki
interpretation and translation by Ikuko Ono

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"We made a gig with J, me, and Murph. In New York City. 3 shows. All Stooges. And it was a way for me to get back. I could barely stand up. I was really sick still. But I wanted to play again. And J helped me out."

Mike：(Finds Amnesty pin on interpreter's bag) "Ah, Amnesty. I've been a member for many many many years. Ten years. This is my union card. Musician. Can you believe it? Punk rocker? (laughs) American Federation of Musicians Local 47. Like a steel worker.

Where did you get that sushi shaped key holder?

Mike：From a man named Kenji in Nagoya. He writes me E-mail. He met me, and he brought me sushi.

A fan of yours in Nagoya?

Mike：Yeah. Somebody from E-mail. I knew Japanese people before even coming here, because of internet. That's why I run my own website. No web master. Just me. HTML. That's what I was trained in in the 70's--it was computers, and then as it changed, I kept up with it just for hobby. And it's a great way to ... do you know what it's like? The old days of punk rock was fanzines. And it's still the same feeling. I don't have to have middle man--no Rolling Stone, no Spin magazine. I can directly interact. I put up tour diaries. I haven't been able to do it here because I don't know how to use the phones. Can't get my stuff up through the phones. As soon as I can, I have written tons about this tour. I have an iBook. I like Mac. Not so much I don't like Steve Jobs, I just hate Bill Gates. I hate him. You know, monopoly ... just bad, bad. Like the Starbucks. I told those people I do not want Starbucks. I said I'd rather support little mom-and-pop Japanese shops. That's what I do in the United States. I fight monopoly. I thought that was the whole idea of cold war. They lie.

Firstly, I want to say I'm very honored to meet you. In Japan you're a legendary figure. We don't know a lot about you yet, so we have a long list of questions for you.

Mike：'Cause it's my first time. Sorry it took so long.

I'm very excited about this opportunity.

Mike：Likewise.

How was it playing here for the first time?

Mike：Oh, incredible. It's a mind-blow. It reminds me of my first gig ever. Or my first time to Europe ever. It's so exciting. First time me and D. Boon got in front of people. But just the experience of coming ... I have to tell you, I've never done vacations. I come from working class. You understand, we're not all rich in the United States. I know it looks that way. But we're not all rich, and the only way I get to visit a place is by working there. And it's incredible for me. My mind is like a sponge that's soaking it all in. Incredible. I'm going to write songs about it.

What is your impression of the audiences here?

Mike：I noticed they were different from town to town. I felt Nagoya very polite. But everybody's very attentive. They watch everything. Not like United States, where people are like, sometimes they're just drinking, and you happen to be playing. Everybody's very attentive, like 'I am here to see this.' Sort of like the way I go to a gig. I'm watching very carefully. But Nagoya, very quiet between the songs. Osaka, loud. It seems Osaka was more like Chicago, Pittsburg--blue collar. Tokyo, more New York City. Tokyo, kind of talking more too, but not as Osaka. Osaka reminded me more of United States audience a little bit. Not being afraid. Nagoya, though, very very calm. Like Belgium.

Belgium?

Mike：Yeah. This is not a disrespect. I'm just saying they have different temperament. So to say all Japanese are the same would be very wrong. It's just like any other place. There's different regions. I'd say Tokyo, more cosmopolitan. They see a lot more bands. So you are maybe held to higher standards. Nagoya, it's like, they don't see maybe as many bands. Things are not automatic. They want to see what you have. But they are not rude, like I've had experiences in other towns. What I'm trying to say is, it wasn't that alien. But in another way, I felt ... I felt they knew more about me than I know about them. But then they made it easy once we started playing.

All of Japan or are you only talking about Nagoya?

Mike：The whole of them particular, but then there's nuances to the regions. Like I said, Osaka was very aaarrrgghh. Nagoya very quiet. Tokyo kind of sophisticated. The knew all the J songs. They even knew the ones I did. Stooges and stuff. So it was a big surprise. More educated in music than United States. Definitely. United States, kids have memory that's very short. They don't even know Stooges. They don't even hardly know Minutemen or fIREHOSE anymore. Our memory, really short. Here, different.

What did you think of the opening band Numbergirl?

Mike：Great. Great band. They were singing in Japanese so it's hard for me to really know what they were saying, but their music, I really liked it. There's not that many bands like them in the United States, because a lot of people don't play with passion. They go by the numbers. If they were in United States, they would be one of my favorite bands to play with. I enjoyed them very much. Kind of reminded me of Sonic Youth a little bit.

Do you think they played with passion?

Mike：Yeah. Like me. I felt a very kinship with them. It didn't feel so far away.

And you don't see a lot of bands like that in America right now?

Mike：No way. No way. Right now, the trend in America is very macho. Sports-like. Like it's a football game or something, you know? Guy posturing ... 'I'm here, you're down there, huge gap between us". Don't like it. These guys remind me of the old days. And I could see the kids all singing the words. They knew them a lot. There was a big bond between audience and band. They look like the kids in the audience. They look like some guys that came out of the audience and started playing. That is my idea of punk. It's a people's music. It's not rock stars and shit like that--on the tenth floor with the big tables (like this).

I saw your first show on the 13th.

Mike：Ah, horrible show for me. My amplifier blew up in the first song. Things happen. So I was in the house, but I never heard one note I played. Can you imagine? But, I'm there to help J. So I cannot let ego take course. Even if it was my show--and this happened once ... I had to do a whole Europe tour without hearing one note--you have to overcome that. But that show, Numbergirl's bass player had a Germs shirt! Darby died 20 years ago. And very small scene in Hollywood then. How would this guy even know? This impressed me very much.

In the show I saw, I thought J was very focused on his guitar playing, more so than the last time I saw him when he came with Dinosaur Jr. I thought maybe that's because of your presence. You are such an exceptional bass player that you brought that out in J.

Mike：Well, the idea of a band is people working together. And bass players ... I gotta tell you my philosophy. Very short. You look good making other guys look good. When you go into a bathroom, some people look at the tile, some people look at the grout between the tiles. I am the grout. I am the cement. I think politically, the bass is the best thing in the band. I never chose it. D. Boon's mother made me play it. It was total accident, but I'm so glad I got into it. So, yes, I think I help J in that way. But man, J is a remarkable musician. His image is of somebody being lazy, or asleep, or a slacker. This is not true. This man's mind ... he just talks slow. My mother's Italian (laughs), so I ... different traditions. He's got a cat there to help him out, maybe this brings this out of him. But I've always seen this in him. You know, I'm 8 years older than him. So ... maybe I'm like a big brother to him, I don't know (laughs). He can sure handle that guitar, though, man. And I'm just trying to be up there. I have to tell you too, do you remember Cream? In the 60's? Jack Bruce, Ginger Baker ....

Yes.

Mike：That's where I first heard music. So that's really where I'm rooted. Punk came to me after I had already learned and it was this thing to open things up. But I come from before. So when I play with J, I kind of go back to when I was a boy.

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